Very confused and I don't know what's happening to me

[jebberjabber]

On 5/12/2022 at 12:53 PM, Ezra Cullen said:

Hey Jeb! I think a useful little thought exercise to help you figure yourself out is trying to imagine yourself having gay experiences. You've mentioned that you had a dream about kissing a boy, can you imagine yourself doing that in real life? or going on a date with a guy? Having a boyfriend? (not to be to blunt) having sex with a guy? Obviously you don't have to share if you don't feel comfortable but I think this helps to give you an idea of what you'd like to explore, and what your next step is.  And of course compare that to how you feel about girls, do you have a preference? 

I know that's all crazy overwhelming. but there's no rush, and remember there's no pressure to tell people about your feelings before your comfortable, people think that if you're not straight you HAVE to tell people, but you don't owe anyone that, you're priority is how you feel. 

I'm not gonna lie, I'm still analysing the enormity of this question, and have been for almost a week (apologies for the slow response). In terms of kissing a guy (and disregarding my old fears of hiding it) I don't feel like it'd be anything different to kissing a girl. I mean, I haven't kissed a girl, either. I only had one girlfriend in high school - we dated, hugged, hung out, but in the end we reverted to being friends. So again, it loops back to my lack of experience in any romantic context. I don't really see the difference between being attracted to a guy and a girl if I'm brutally honest with myself. I'd love to have a boyfriend or a girlfriend or to kiss someone: what matters is the emotional bond I share with them. I don't think I could do the whole dating thing, or drunken night out. I'd have to be friends and really get to know a partner first before being romantic in any way. I know that sounds kinda weird, but what doesn't in this whole confusion?

Regarding sex, I don't think I'd ever want to have sex, gay or straight. I know, I haven't tried it yet, I'm inexperienced, immature, whatever. All but one person in our friend group has had sex and this is pretty much the reaction I get. It just feels... weird to look at. Kind of gross and mechanical. I'm not sure if it's okay to talk further about this because it's sort of 'private' but there you go. I'm not saying I'm totally averse to sex, just that it doesn't appeal to me as much as it really should, being a teenage guy and all.

On 5/13/2022 at 6:08 AM, Monsoon said:

Hey there,

I'm back :)

I'm glad you can still keep in contact over Discord. Could you maybe do a video call or something with them to socialise a little bit more? 

Well, things took a bit of a jump social-wise.

Got drunk for the first time ever on Friday night. I've already finished high school back home in New Zealand, but some mates of mine were off having a pint at the pub to celebrate their last day. Turns out it wasn't just my mates, we ended up hanging out with half the year group. Well, one pint became a pub crawl (okay, there are only four pubs in our village, and only three actually served us) and then someone decided instead of going home we should stock up on cheap booze and go to a local park.

I was very cold, as I'd come out in 1pm blazing sun and it was now past 7. However, I was tipsy at this point and decided to go, reasoning that I would regret NOT going. A cute girl did give me a wonderfully comfortable pink jumper though so that sealed my fate, as it were. Unfortunately (depending on your view of alcohol) I ended up inverting my usual antisocial nervousness, and got totally shit faced. The main thing I remember is rolling down a hill because I couldn't tie my shoelaces.

Woke up this morning (surprisingly normal, aren't you supposed to get hangovers?) and a) saw several injuries that I hadn't had the day before, b) a bunch of texts I didn't remember sending to people I didn’t know and c) the nameless dread of having said something I shouldn't have and not remembering what it was. A friend reassured me I hadn't offended anyone, but I still have that horrible prickle that I've revealed something. I'm just hoping it wasn't a) my recently questioned sexuality or b) any of my emotional vulnerabilities. I had fun, sure, but at what cost? The scary thing is, I don't even know.

[Ezra Cullen]

Well dude, to me it sounds like you're bi. Which there's absolutely nothing wrong with btw, and you don't have to worry if you feel preferences or differences in how you feel towards guys or girls.

I know like 20 bi people and the definition doesn't suit ANYONE exactly, everyone's kinda unique.

For example I like guys MORE than girls, but I still do stuff with girls (drunken nights out ect) 

And DO NOT worry about the sex thing, you say you don't feel  "the way you should" for a teenage boy, but  there's  no specific way you have to feel. There's absolutely no pressure, if you're not into sex, you're not into it. I do still reccomend trying it to see if you can tolerate it since you're future partners more than likely will have sex drives. If you can't that's fine too! There's plenty of asexual people in the world. 

[Ezra Cullen]

Oh and listen I'm not claiming to be an expert on all things gay but I'd consider myself relatively experienced, if you have any questions about literally anything I'll do my best to answer.

Don't freak out, don't pressure yourself,  I'm here if you wanna vent

[jebberjabber]

36 minutes ago, Ezra Cullen said:

Well dude, to me it sounds like you're bi. Which there's absolutely nothing wrong with btw, and you don't have to worry if you feel preferences or differences in how you feel towards guys or girls.

I know like 20 bi people and the definition doesn't suit ANYONE exactly, everyone's kinda unique.

For example I like guys MORE than girls, but I still do stuff with girls (drunken nights out ect) 

And DO NOT worry about the sex thing, you say you don't feel  "the way you should" for a teenage boy, but  there's  no specific way you have to feel. There's absolutely no pressure, if you're not into sex, you're not into it. I do still reccomend trying it to see if you can tolerate it since you're future partners more than likely will have sex drives. If you can't that's fine too! There's plenty of asexual people in the world. 

Sounds fair enough. I guess I have to confront the reality of the facts at some point and I'd rather it happen now that at some later, drawn-out point. I feel like I need to see if it's true, prove it to myself... does that make sense? It might be another form of denial in actuality: in which case I guess I have a way to go. Argh. It feels weird having this big fat secret looming over my head and constantly worrying about losing control of it before I'm ready, but at the same time it's driving me insane NOT talking to people. I'm in a bit of a social vacuum if you can't tell, and that weird loneliness kinda makes it worse. Sounds desperate in retrospect, but I am at this point, so I own it 

[Ezra Cullen]

Just now, jebberjabber said:

Sounds fair enough. I guess I have to confront the reality of the facts at some point and I'd rather it happen now that at some later, drawn-out point. I feel like I need to see if it's true, prove it to myself... does that make sense? It might be another form of denial in actuality: in which case I guess I have a way to go. Argh. It feels weird having this big fat secret looming over my head and constantly worrying about losing control of it before I'm ready, but at the same time it's driving me insane NOT talking to people. I'm in a bit of a social vacuum if you can't tell, and that weird loneliness kinda makes it worse. Sounds desperate in retrospect, but I am at this point, so I own it 

Well if you need someone to talk to I'm always around. I'm the secret-gay-bestie of like 30 pl at this point, 1 more won't hurt.

But I do understand what you mean when you say you need to prove it to yourself, absolutely. Literally every bi person deals with this. 

Step 1 is "coming out to yourself"  it can take 3 minutes or a year, again I can't stress  ENOUGH  that there's no pressure. You're not going to turn straight if you wait long enough , but you kinda got to face the music 

"I'm capable of being attracted to guys, and that's ok, I'm bisexual and that's ok, this is a part of who I am and I am not ashamed"  

It actually feels kinda amazing when you get done with it.

[jebberjabber]

43 minutes ago, Ezra Cullen said:

Well if you need someone to talk to I'm always around. I'm the secret-gay-bestie of like 30 pl at this point, 1 more won't hurt.

But I do understand what you mean when you say you need to prove it to yourself, absolutely. Literally every bi person deals with this. 

Step 1 is "coming out to yourself"  it can take 3 minutes or a year, again I can't stress  ENOUGH  that there's no pressure. You're not going to turn straight if you wait long enough , but you kinda got to face the music 

"I'm capable of being attracted to guys, and that's ok, I'm bisexual and that's ok, this is a part of who I am and I am not ashamed"  

It actually feels kinda amazing when you get done with it.

It makes sense, that stage is what I'm dealing with right now. The more I think about it, the more I'd like to try a romantic relationship with a guy (although having a girlfriend would be awesome too). The problem is, I don't really know how to meet people. My two 'guy crushes' were and are straight, as far as I know. I actually ran into the second guy crush during Friday night's party hoping to chat to him a little, but judging how insistent he was on getting with a girl I can safely assume he's not in the running. So I got wasted instead and don't remember much of the rest.

The problem is the human baseline of being straight. I only know two openly gay guys in our school, and I'm not interested in either of them. The issue is, I don't know how to meet others. I mean, I want to. I just have no idea where to start with this, but at the same time I don't want to get close to someone only to find they're straight. I know four months until I go to university isn't that long, but to someone who's been sitting with these feelings alone and repressing them for close to four years, that feels like an eternity.

[Ezra Cullen]

Ok so first off I'd try and evaluate if you actually like guys more or if it just seems new and exciting,

I'm not accusing you! It's just a VERY common thing for people who start to accept themselves as bi.

And I don't want to state the obvious but your profile says you're 18, you could try a gay bar? There's also loads of gay dating apps. 

And yeah having a crush on a straight guy SUCKS, my crush when I was 16 was like OPENLY homophobic . 

[jebberjabber]

19 minutes ago, Ezra Cullen said:

Ok so first off I'd try and evaluate if you actually like guys more or if it just seems new and exciting,

I'm not accusing you! It's just a VERY common thing for people who start to accept themselves as bi.

And I don't want to state the obvious but your profile says you're 18, you could try a gay bar? There's also loads of gay dating apps. 

And yeah having a crush on a straight guy SUCKS, my crush when I was 16 was like OPENLY homophobic . 

No worries, that first part is my exact problem right now.

I honestly don't know about a gay bar. I'm not sure if there's any in my area for one, and one the other hand I'm kinda terrified about going to any bar alone. It's like the old saying, 'the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak'. I'd love to try it out, but a thousand fears in my mind are holding me back. It's a weird one, isn't it? To finally have the freedom of an adult yet be so afraid of using that freedom. To add on to that, I've never used a dating app: isn't 18 too young for that? How do you even get started? If I'm questioning being bi, or even if I am actually bi, would I not be leading a gay guy on? I wouldn't want to ruin anyone's expectations.

Edited May 16, 2022 by jebberjabber

[Ezra Cullen]

5 hours ago, jebberjabber said:

No worries, that first part is my exact problem right now.

I honestly don't know about a gay bar. I'm not sure if there's any in my area for one, and one the other hand I'm kinda terrified about going to any bar alone. It's like the old saying, 'the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak'. I'd love to try it out, but a thousand fears in my mind are holding me back. It's a weird one, isn't it? To finally have the freedom of an adult yet be so afraid of using that freedom. To add on to that, I've never used a dating app: isn't 18 too young for that? How do you even get started? If I'm questioning being bi, or even if I am actually bi, would I not be leading a gay guy on? I wouldn't want to ruin anyone's expectations.

Yeah, you DO have to be fully transparent when you're flirting with a guy, yknow?

"I've never done this before, and I'm still figuring myself out, so please don't feel like I'm leading you on"

But that's fine and after a while those insecurities DO fade.

As far as finding cute gays, I'll be brutally honest here, stereotypes exist for a reason. My theory is that since guys act masculine to impress girls, us gays look effeminate by comparison. It's totally fine if you don't fit that stereotype too. But like, my lesbian friends all have six packs, my gay friends all love Taylor swift, if you're trying to find a gay guy it's not offensive to look for traits people consider gay.

[Ezra Cullen]

But anyway, you're 18! You have all the time in the world to figure this out and find someone accordingly. What's  most important is not to panic yourself about it.

[Monsoon]

12 hours ago, jebberjabber said:

I'm not gonna lie, I'm still analysing the enormity of this question, and have been for almost a week (apologies for the slow response). In terms of kissing a guy (and disregarding my old fears of hiding it) I don't feel like it'd be anything different to kissing a girl. I mean, I haven't kissed a girl, either. I only had one girlfriend in high school - we dated, hugged, hung out, but in the end we reverted to being friends. So again, it loops back to my lack of experience in any romantic context. I don't really see the difference between being attracted to a guy and a girl if I'm brutally honest with myself. I'd love to have a boyfriend or a girlfriend or to kiss someone: what matters is the emotional bond I share with them. I don't think I could do the whole dating thing, or drunken night out. I'd have to be friends and really get to know a partner first before being romantic in any way. I know that sounds kinda weird, but what doesn't in this whole confusion?

Regarding sex, I don't think I'd ever want to have sex, gay or straight. I know, I haven't tried it yet, I'm inexperienced, immature, whatever. All but one person in our friend group has had sex and this is pretty much the reaction I get. It just feels... weird to look at. Kind of gross and mechanical. I'm not sure if it's okay to talk further about this because it's sort of 'private' but there you go. I'm not saying I'm totally averse to sex, just that it doesn't appeal to me as much as it really should, being a teenage guy and all.

Well, things took a bit of a jump social-wise.

Got drunk for the first time ever on Friday night. I've already finished high school back home in New Zealand, but some mates of mine were off having a pint at the pub to celebrate their last day. Turns out it wasn't just my mates, we ended up hanging out with half the year group. Well, one pint became a pub crawl (okay, there are only four pubs in our village, and only three actually served us) and then someone decided instead of going home we should stock up on cheap booze and go to a local park.

I was very cold, as I'd come out in 1pm blazing sun and it was now past 7. However, I was tipsy at this point and decided to go, reasoning that I would regret NOT going. A cute girl did give me a wonderfully comfortable pink jumper though so that sealed my fate, as it were. Unfortunately (depending on your view of alcohol) I ended up inverting my usual antisocial nervousness, and got totally shit faced. The main thing I remember is rolling down a hill because I couldn't tie my shoelaces.

Woke up this morning (surprisingly normal, aren't you supposed to get hangovers?) and a) saw several injuries that I hadn't had the day before, b) a bunch of texts I didn't remember sending to people I didn’t know and c) the nameless dread of having said something I shouldn't have and not remembering what it was. A friend reassured me I hadn't offended anyone, but I still have that horrible prickle that I've revealed something. I'm just hoping it wasn't a) my recently questioned sexuality or b) any of my emotional vulnerabilities. I had fun, sure, but at what cost? The scary thing is, I don't even know.

Hey there,

It sounds like you had a pretty wild night! Was this the first time you've been drunk like that? From what you've said, you definitely have the 'beer fear' - have you heard of that before? I'm wondering, even if you did say something about your sexuality or emotional vulnerabilities, is that a bad thing? If so, can you tell me more? 

[jebberjabber]

3 hours ago, Monsoon said:

Hey there,

It sounds like you had a pretty wild night! Was this the first time you've been drunk like that? From what you've said, you definitely have the 'beer fear' - have you heard of that before? I'm wondering, even if you did say something about your sexuality or emotional vulnerabilities, is that a bad thing? If so, can you tell me more? 

Nope, that was the first time I've ever been drunk. I've never heard of 'beer fear' before - what is that? 

Regarding vulnerabilities, I feel like I have to keep them private because people wouldn't understand. I have to keep up and stay relaxed, know what I mean? I can't fall to pieces and let people in like that. I don't think I'm ready. 

That goes for sexuality too. I'm not ready to let people know in real life yet. I feel like it would be a massive change and people might think differently of me for it. I'm not ready to handle that yet. 

[Monsoon]

Basically, beer fear is where you have anxiety the next day after getting really drunk, and the anxieties tend to be around offending people and/or opening up too much. 

Also, I completely get what you're saying about not wanting to tell people about your sexuality at the moment; that's completely understandable. With the vulnerabilities, it's interesting what you said about how people wouldn't understand. I'm wondering, what have your experiences of being vulnerable in the past been like for you? How did people respond? 

[jebberjabber]

1 hour ago, Monsoon said:

Basically, beer fear is where you have anxiety the next day after getting really drunk, and the anxieties tend to be around offending people and/or opening up too much. 

Also, I completely get what you're saying about not wanting to tell people about your sexuality at the moment; that's completely understandable. With the vulnerabilities, it's interesting what you said about how people wouldn't understand. I'm wondering, what have your experiences of being vulnerable in the past been like for you? How did people respond? 

Ah, that 'anxiety' does make sense. Actually it describes most of Saturday pretty well.

With vulnerabilities, I feel like it's kinda frowned upon or discouraged to open up emotionally as a guy. I'm worried about how people might respond, and I don't think anything positive would come of it. So... I've never actually opened up about it. I used to tell some of it to a school counsellor, but even then I'd find myself downplaying it and trying to make it less of a big deal. That's another reason why I came and signed up here.

Edited May 16, 2022 by jebberjabber

[Monsoon]

Hey there,

Yeah, there are stereotypes around men not being as open as women, but times are changing and I think that society is abandoning this idea; there are so many well-being campaigns aimed at men now, so I think we are seeing a difference. I’m wondering, how has it felt for you opening up here and with the counsellor? What were/are the positives and negatives? 

[jebberjabber]

15 hours ago, Monsoon said:

Hey there,

Yeah, there are stereotypes around men not being as open as women, but times are changing and I think that society is abandoning this idea; there are so many well-being campaigns aimed at men now, so I think we are seeing a difference. I’m wondering, how has it felt for you opening up here and with the counsellor? What were/are the positives and negatives? 

If I'm honest, I struggled a lot to open up to the counsellor. She was perfectly nice, but somehow, seeing my issues and traumas said out loud in the open made me feel sort of exposed; I was constantly on edge, downplaying everything, not telling the whole truth, keeping the worst parts secret, that kind of thing. The only positive about it was that it was somewhere and someone to go to, even if I couldn't bring myself to be fully truthful. Letting ten percent of pressure out of a blocked valve is better than releasing nothing at all, right?

[Monsoon]

17 hours ago, jebberjabber said:

If I'm honest, I struggled a lot to open up to the counsellor. She was perfectly nice, but somehow, seeing my issues and traumas said out loud in the open made me feel sort of exposed; I was constantly on edge, downplaying everything, not telling the whole truth, keeping the worst parts secret, that kind of thing. The only positive about it was that it was somewhere and someone to go to, even if I couldn't bring myself to be fully truthful. Letting ten percent of pressure out of a blocked valve is better than releasing nothing at all, right?

Hey there,

Yeah, it's absolutely better letting 10% of pressure out rather than nothing at all, so that's great :) 

I'm wondering, by even letting those little bits out, how was that for you? Was it helpful?

[jebberjabber]

On 5/18/2022 at 5:33 PM, Monsoon said:

Hey there,

Yeah, it's absolutely better letting 10% of pressure out rather than nothing at all, so that's great :) 

I'm wondering, by even letting those little bits out, how was that for you? Was it helpful?

I'm... not sure? Probably, in the end it did help, even though I didn't really think of it that way at the time. Mind you, I had a 'professional counsellor' who was terrible - she kept inferring things I hadn't said and it felt like she wasn't listening to me. So I guess it depends on the situation and the counsellor themselves. 

[Monsoon]

13 hours ago, jebberjabber said:

I'm... not sure? Probably, in the end it did help, even though I didn't really think of it that way at the time. Mind you, I had a 'professional counsellor' who was terrible - she kept inferring things I hadn't said and it felt like she wasn't listening to me. So I guess it depends on the situation and the counsellor themselves. 

Hey there,

Ah, yeah, it absolutely depends on the situation and the counsellor; the relationship is so important, and you need to feel like they're listening to you. I'm wondering, how much percentage steam do you feel you've let out here, and how has that been for you?

[jebberjabber]

8 minutes ago, Monsoon said:

Hey there,

Ah, yeah, it absolutely depends on the situation and the counsellor; the relationship is so important, and you need to feel like they're listening to you. I'm wondering, how much percentage steam do you feel you've let out here, and how has that been for you?

I'd say here it's closer to 30% or so. It helps being relatively anonymous and also without a time limit. I can take a couple days to think about answers or have a break from the thread, unlike counselling where you have a booked session and that's pretty much it.

[Monsoon]

3 hours ago, jebberjabber said:

I'd say here it's closer to 30% or so. It helps being relatively anonymous and also without a time limit. I can take a couple days to think about answers or have a break from the thread, unlike counselling where you have a booked session and that's pretty much it.

Hey there,

That makes sense around how having no time limit and being anonymous helps you to be more open. I'm wondering, what do you think would help you to get to 30% with a therapist then? 

[jebberjabber]

On 5/22/2022 at 4:36 PM, Monsoon said:

Hey there,

That makes sense around how having no time limit and being anonymous helps you to be more open. I'm wondering, what do you think would help you to get to 30% with a therapist then? 

If I'm honest, I don't think I could get to 30% or higher with a physical therapist. Part of the whole therapy process feels deeply uncomfortable to me, and always has. I can't quite name it. Here's it's fine - I'm 'in control' - I start the conversation, I respond to questions, I don't answer things I'm uncomfortable with. In real life, there's often an element of questioning - I'm not in control, not in power. The therapist or counsellor took the lead and I felt like a bug under a microscope. I guess I'm just not very good at opening up.

[Monsoon]

Hey there,

It's interesting that you felt like a bug under a microscope. In therapy, you can set up a certain way of working and say that you'd like to take the lead; what would therapy be like for you if you had that conversation? 

[Ambi]

@jebberjabber I just wanted to let you know you are not alone. I have been exactly where you are and it wasn't until recently that I started to figure things out. I isolated myself for a really long time, especially during covid, and I too have/had a group of queer friends. I had the same feelings you had for a while and I was super confused. I had crushes on guys before, but I did start to find girls attractive as well and I denied those feelings for a long time. I denied them through crushes, I denied them sex dreams, I even denied them to my queer friends who I think knew I wasn't just straight. I even had a crush like you that I pushed away because I was confused about my feelings. I'm not saying you're bisexual like me, but you could be, and a new setting could be the perfect time for you to explore this side of you. Even though I have finally accepted myself, I'm still not really "out" because I don't think I'm ready yet. Don't feel pressured to have to come out, but you do have to accept yourself, whatever you may be, whoever you may love. A piece of advice: next time you have a crush, which you will even though its been a while, explore that relationship, don't push them away. Also, join clubs or activities. Joining colorguard saved my life. I had been isolating myself for so long, but forcing myself to be on a team gave me a whole new set of friends and it made me go to more social events. You mentioned an LGBTQ club at your new university. If that's the thing you want to join, great. You could also join a club that has to do with a hobby you like are a new hobby you want to try. Just put yourself out there. Most universities have big events you can go to. Sometimes you feel less pressure if you go out alone to be with a crowd of people.

...and now I feel like I'm rambling, but I would love to talk more. Message me whenever.